Loopback mapping and level control

[Kroz Prozor Fabrika]

Hi everyone,
I upgraded QLC+ yesterday, being interested by this new loopback possibility.
Using QLC+ for basic theatre shows with traditional lighting fixtures, I am, for a while, trying to find a way to be able to readjust manually a function during a live performance from the virtual console (and not from editing scene mode).
I.e. playing scene 1, the fixture 1 goes in intensity from 0 to 50%, lacking light, I readjust and push it to 60%.
The change monitor box for the sliders seemed to be a solution. Unfortunately it is not possible to take over.

Checking the loopback plugins, it seemed to me possible. Assigning, as specified loopback 1 as output of Universe 1, input of Universe 2, addressing Universe 2 address 1 to trigger the slider controlling the fixture 1 in intensity.
Now, when I play the scene 1 from a button, the slider follows, when I deselect the scene 1, the slider (and fixture it commands) stays at the value the scene 1 assigned. It is only by moving the slider back to 0 that the fixture turns off. Is that related to HTP/LTP modes (if yes how to go from one to the other)?
Is there a way for the slider to follow when the function goes off? I tried different possibilities and didn't find any way.
Thanks fro your help, and above all, thanks for the work you've done!
Greetings,
JB

[plugz]

Hi,

I'm not sure I understand your loopback solution, can you share the workspace file ?



Also, here's another option:
In the virtual console, create a frame.
Put a button in the frame, link the button to your scene.
Put a slider in the frame, set the slider to "Submaster" mode.

[janosvitok]

Submaster will not allow to increase the light output, only decrease.

[plugz]

Yes, this only works with scene intensities to 100%. It may miss the requirements.

[Kroz Prozor Fabrika]

Hi guys,
Sorry for the delay, I was expecting email notification so I didn’t see that you immediately replied.
Here attached a copy of the workspace.

Loopback test.qxw

Workspace

(7.71 KiB) Downloaded 281 times

Content:
2 reflectors, 2 scenes.
Universe 1, output loopback 1 (and we could imagine external MIDI controller as input)
Universe 2, input loopback 1 (and we could imagine USB-DMX as output)

Situation (1):
a) I play Scene 1 (on). Reflectors 1 & 2 follow on the control panel.
b) I deselect scene 1 (off). Instead of getting a 0 DMX value, reflectors 1 & 2 remain on the values assigned by scene 1 when it was on.

My goal is to be able to control live the values of the reflectors 1 & 2.
Situation (2):
a) I play Scene 1 (on). Reflectors 1 & 2 follow on the control panel.
b) I manually add 10% to reflector 2 from the control panel. Reflector 2 follows.
c) I manually fade out reflector 2 while I deselect scene 1 (off). Here the Reflector 2 follows the command given on the control panel, but not (as in Situation 1) the 0 DMX value given by deselecting Scene 1.

I am quite enthusiastic with the loopback mapping possibility because it seems it could solve what the monitoring faders can’t.
Indeed, the faders in the monitoring panel can only increase the DMX value of a reflector when a scene is on, never decrease it (as now the control panel allows it thanks to the loopback mapping).
I hope this would make my issue and request clearer. Thanks again for your time.
JB

[mumbles]

OK I going to try agin. hopefully Im closer to the subject this time.

In file I have 2 sliders ( Dimmer1 & Dimmer 2) & 3 buttons

Buttons are Hot keyed to 1,2,& 3

hit 1 and 3 at the same time. bring Dim1 & 2 up to [150].

manually adj Dim 2 up 10%

hit 1 to drop Dim 1 to [0]

then manually pull down Dim 2 to [0] (when you get slider to [0] then your ok to deselect button 3)


Am I any closer this time

[plugz]

Hi,

• Situation (1):
  a) I play Scene 1 (on). Reflectors 1 & 2 follow on the control panel.
  b) I deselect scene 1 (off). Instead of getting a 0 DMX value, reflectors 1 & 2 remain on the values assigned by scene 1 when it was on.

  Here you want the faders to go to zero when the scene is cut.

  My goal is to be able to control live the values of the reflectors 1 & 2.
  Situation (2):
  a) I play Scene 1 (on). Reflectors 1 & 2 follow on the control panel.
  b) I manually add 10% to reflector 2 from the control panel. Reflector 2 follows.
  c) I manually fade out reflector 2 while I deselect scene 1 (off). Here the Reflector 2 follows the command given on the control panel, but not (as in Situation 1) the 0 DMX value given by deselecting Scene 1.

  Here you want the faders to NOT go to zero when the scene is cut.
  
  It seems the 2 situations are not compatible :/
• Unrelated to the issue here, but where is the actual output ? On which universe do you output the DMX data ? The loopback uses universe1 output, and I don't see any fixture set on the other universes.
• And the 2 faders send loopback on themselves, that's... strange ? This may have undefined behavior.
• Here's a modification of your workspace.
  The loopback input/output are both on universe 2.
  The "actual" output (that can be set to dmx usb or whatever) is on universe 1.
  Scenes affect the loopback channels (on universe 2), and the faders affect the actual output channels (on universe 1).
  The 2 faders you created are unaware that scenes exist, they can't have any effect on the scenes themselves. This means that when you play scene1 (150,150), then change the slider (like to 120), then cut scene1 off, when you restart the scene, the value will be back to (150,150).

[Kroz Prozor Fabrika]

Hi,
Excuse-me for the delay, it took me some time to come back from vacations and some more to understand the changes on the workspace
I liked the logic of the virtual dimmer in the universe 2. It could be a beautiful solution.
I could put an USB-DMX output on universe 1 and everything would be solved.
My problem is that I still miss one part, that I can't figure how to solve. I've been through your proposition again and again and I finally decided to write again.
I would like to control the faders (Dimmer control 1 & 2) through midi control. But I see where to put it as input.
I will not bother you mentioning all the attempts I've made (adding universes, adding virtual dimmers), I failed every time. There is maybe a simple way that I am not able to see.
Thanks again for your help.
JB

[mumbles]

Hi,
Excuse-me for the delay, it took me some time to come back from vacations and some more to understand the changes on the workspace
I liked the logic of the virtual dimmer in the universe 2. It could be a beautiful solution.
I could put an USB-DMX output on universe 1 and everything would be solved.
My problem is that I still miss one part, that I can't figure how to solve. I've been through your proposition again and again and I finally decided to write again.
I would like to control the faders (Dimmer control 1 & 2) through midi control. But I see where to put it as input.
I will not bother you mentioning all the attempts I've made (adding universes, adding virtual dimmers), I failed every time. There is maybe a simple way that I am not able to see.
Thanks again for your help.
JB

So if understand correctly you've got your VC functioning the way you want and now you're wanting to map a physical slider on your midi controller? If this is correct. would you mind telling us what midi controller your trying to use?

under inputs/outputs tad
1)set universe input as your midi (this can be a universe setup just to patch your midi in if you have to. but not recommended unless necessary)
2)select your midi controller under profile tab

under virtual console
3)select widget
4)under widget property> External Input
5)select auto detect
6)move slider or tap button (you should see where key was mapped) FYI input universe will have the name of your midi controller and input be the button or slider of your midi controller.

option 2 under virtual console
3)select widget
4)under widget property> External Input
5)select choose
6)find midi controller in list and select your button/ slider/ knob

hope this helps
slider 1 & 2 are mapped to control Reflector 1 & 2 with nanoKontrol2. I'm attaching this file just as example of midi map settings.

[mumbles]

Another thing to note is loopback under inputs/outputs tab is not used for USB midi controllers even if usb midi controller is setup on a different universe than the DMX devices your trying to control. Virtual Console widgets mapping handles the "loopback" control of midi devices. If setting up universe for midi controllers use only. I recommend leaving output & feedback fields set to none unless your midi controller has feedback capabilities. loopback under inputs/outputs is used for loopback DMX, Artnet, OSC etc. Mainly used when you need to use multiple IP's, subnet, or multiple IP protocols for inputs only from what I can tell.

[Kroz Prozor Fabrika]

Hi,
I am not sure we understood each other (unless, of course, I didn't understand the solution you propose).
I was not asking how to map a physical midi controller in general, but in this very situation that @Plugz started to solve.
Meaning: how to take over a scene through the sliders that are controlling reflectors intensity (not only to go above the levels of the scene, but also to decrease them)
All @Plugz's solution (cf the workspace he attached) works fine. But in this situation the loopback1 is using the input channel + mapped to control the sliders so I don't find how to add an external midi controller.
If that helps the midi controllers are of several kind, gathered into a single virtual midi cable. But if we manage to do it for NanoKontrol2 as you proposed, it would work for all.
Check @plugz workspace if you have time, to see how to adjust the mapping there.
I guess that if we find a solution it would be worth making a wiki page out of it, since I saw few time that request in the forum, before QLC+ implemented the loopback mapping.
Thanks.

[mumbles]

sorry for the repost. the first post ended up at the top for some reason so Im reposting.

OK I going to try agin. hopefully Im closer to the topic this time. This file allows you to trigger a scene to initiate a set value i.e.[150] then manually adjust independent fixtures with sliders overriding scene values up or down. it also allow you to deselect scene to drop value to [0] if you want at anytime even after manually adjusting with sliders.

In file I have 2 sliders ( Dimmer1 & Dimmer 2) & 3 buttons

Buttons are Hot keyed to 1,2,& 3

1)Press 1 and 3 on keyboard at the same time. (brings Dim1 & 2 up to [150]).

2)manually adjust Dim 1 and/ or 2 up or down (if you want)

3)Pressing 1 to drop Dim 1 to [0]

4)then manually pull down Dim 2 to [0] (when you get slider to [0] then your ok to deselect button 3)

Am I any closer this time?

[mumbles]

Ive gotten midi patch in and working kind of. The only problem is when once my slider gets to [0] scene button over rides fixture values. as long as I stop slider at [1] everything is ok. problem there is fixtures are also still outputting a value of [1].

Ill post file when I have time to write how it works.