head doesnt move in circle but rather a figure 8
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ryan
i am using q light controller plus version 4.8.1 on windows 7 64-bit on a hp probook 450 g1. i am trying to make 2 chauvet intimidator spot 400 irc's go in a circle. however when i make a new fx and click test run on the circle fx it makes a figure 8 instead of a circle. any help is greatly appreciated! thank you! if i have left out any information please let me know. i tend to forget to include some information so i apologize in advance!
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david garyga
Hi Ryan,
For a better understanding of the EFX feature, go to the simple desk, and play with the PAN/TILT channels of your fixture.
See how your fixture move when you move the channels.
A 0->255 movement on PAN will make your fixture move 540⁰, and a 0->255 movement on TILT will make you fixture move 270⁰.
Now, go to the EFX editor, and look at the graph:
X and Y are PAN and TILT, from 0 to 255.
With a full sized circle, you can see that X goes from the far left to the far right of the graph, this means a 0->255 PAN channel change, this means a 540⁰ move for your fixture.
Now change the size/positionning of the circle, and see what happens.
For a better understanding of the EFX feature, go to the simple desk, and play with the PAN/TILT channels of your fixture.
See how your fixture move when you move the channels.
A 0->255 movement on PAN will make your fixture move 540⁰, and a 0->255 movement on TILT will make you fixture move 270⁰.
Now, go to the EFX editor, and look at the graph:
X and Y are PAN and TILT, from 0 to 255.
With a full sized circle, you can see that X goes from the far left to the far right of the graph, this means a 0->255 PAN channel change, this means a 540⁰ move for your fixture.
Now change the size/positionning of the circle, and see what happens.
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ryan
would it be possible to provide a screen shot so that i may have a better idea of where to start. my fixture is hanging from truss the 9'6" high. when my fixture is pointing straight down it measures 7'6" off the ground. i have tried messing with the x/y as well as the height/width for a couple of hours and i cannot seem to get this fixture to stop doing a figure 8 lol. are there any in depth tutorials anywhere that i may look at?
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david garyga
I'll try to make screenshots when I have some time.
For now...
Did you go to the simple desk ? I think it should help you understand what the representation on the EFX editor means.
OR if you want to see if it's even possible to draw a circle, put these values in the EFX editor:
Width 42
Height 42
X offset 64
Y offset 64
Rotation 0
Start Offset 0
For now...
Did you go to the simple desk ? I think it should help you understand what the representation on the EFX editor means.
OR if you want to see if it's even possible to draw a circle, put these values in the EFX editor:
Width 42
Height 42
X offset 64
Y offset 64
Rotation 0
Start Offset 0
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ryan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1j6OFEGqF4
i found this tutorial which was helpful to some extent but does not explain y my fixture would be moving in a figure 8 insteaad of a circle.
i found this tutorial which was helpful to some extent but does not explain y my fixture would be moving in a figure 8 insteaad of a circle.
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ryan
i went to the simple desk yes. it seems to try and make a figure 8 even when i set it to make a square lol. with the numbers you gave me it still makes a figure 8 lol
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ryan
yes i did. i put them under the parameters section of the movement tab in the efx editor. i am going to try my fixtures 8 channel mode to see if there is any difference and use the values u gave me. thank you for your continued assistance it is greatly appreciated!
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david garyga
What about this can't-be-more-simple workspace ?
- Attachments
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simple_circle.qxw- (2.3 KiB) Downloaded 31 times
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ryan
i opened a new workspace added my fixture clicked new fx and entered the values u gave me and no relative is not checked. i tried to see what would happen if it was checked and it only went in a straight line. lol
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ryan
should it make any difference if i have the program trying to make circle in the center of the graph pointing my fixture straight down?
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david garyga
Yes, it should make a huge difference. If you want to make a circle like this, you should only move the PAN channel. Try to draw an horizontal line on the graphical representation, slightly above the center. (reduce height to zero, put Y offset to 110).
Also, try the workspace I attached before.
Also, try the workspace I attached before.
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ryan
that works! thank you! what about if i wanted it to move in a continuous circle? would i have to manually program that?
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qualleyiv
I realize that the issue that the original poster has here is one that comes from a lack of understanding (and I mean no offense by that), but I do think it raises a valid point with respect to the EFX layout. Clearly the descriptions (e.g. figure 8) accurately represent the DMX values as plotted on an X-Y plane, but given the fact that the pan and tilt ranges of fixtures differs, the result is often far different than what is expected. For example, as David points out I think what the OP really wants given the way his fixtures are setup is actually a horizontal line with a bit of Y offset which is really quite counterintuitive.
Is there a better way to represent this in QLC+?
Is there a better way to represent this in QLC+?
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Jano Svitok
Ryan:
1. think of PAN and TILT as angular coordinates. They are not a position on a plane, rather angle in a sphere.
2. we all know circle has only 360 degrees, but the PAN is usually 540 degrees, i.e. 1 1/2 of full circle, so there is an overlap. Therefore, some head positions/angles can be achieved by more PAN/TILT values.
3. as George mentioned, since the PAN range and TILT range are usually not the same, so isn't the same the conversion ratio from DMX values to degrees.
e.g. if PAN range is 540, one DMX step is 540/255 ~ 2 degrees, while if TILT range is 270, one DMX step is 270/255 ~ 1 degree. That means if you want to have a perfect circle, you have to make EFX height 2x the EFX width.
It's useful to make a table with some useful angles like 0 deg, 45 deg, 90 deg, etc. Calculator is your friend
4. Relative checkbox: when it is off, the EFX position is absolute. In other words, you can position the EFX anywhere you want, and it will be run exactly there.
Let's say you have the head mounted to an overhead truss pointing straight down. If you make an circle EFX with width=20, height=40, offset x=128, offset y=128, you will get a circle with a diameter of ~40 degrees on the floor exactly below the truss. If you now change the offset Y to 32 (128-90*(270/255)), the head will be doing the same circle, but will be pointing horizontally.
This way, you can make several presets: like circle at the stage centre, circle stage left, stage right, overhead, etc. One EFX for each position.
If you want to have also 8, again one EFX for each position.
This is where relative comes handy: When relative is checked, EFX is added to whatever position the head is currently. You can create positions as Scenes with PAN/TILT channels, and create your EFX in a neutral position with offset x=127 and offset y=127. So you will have: set of position scenes (stage centre, circle stage left, stage right, overhead, etc.) and set of neutral EFX (circle, 8,...). In VC, create a set of buttons (solo frame) for positions, and another for EFX. You can even add XYPad and move the circle during the show wherever you want.
1. think of PAN and TILT as angular coordinates. They are not a position on a plane, rather angle in a sphere.
2. we all know circle has only 360 degrees, but the PAN is usually 540 degrees, i.e. 1 1/2 of full circle, so there is an overlap. Therefore, some head positions/angles can be achieved by more PAN/TILT values.
3. as George mentioned, since the PAN range and TILT range are usually not the same, so isn't the same the conversion ratio from DMX values to degrees.
e.g. if PAN range is 540, one DMX step is 540/255 ~ 2 degrees, while if TILT range is 270, one DMX step is 270/255 ~ 1 degree. That means if you want to have a perfect circle, you have to make EFX height 2x the EFX width.
It's useful to make a table with some useful angles like 0 deg, 45 deg, 90 deg, etc. Calculator is your friend
4. Relative checkbox: when it is off, the EFX position is absolute. In other words, you can position the EFX anywhere you want, and it will be run exactly there.
Let's say you have the head mounted to an overhead truss pointing straight down. If you make an circle EFX with width=20, height=40, offset x=128, offset y=128, you will get a circle with a diameter of ~40 degrees on the floor exactly below the truss. If you now change the offset Y to 32 (128-90*(270/255)), the head will be doing the same circle, but will be pointing horizontally.
This way, you can make several presets: like circle at the stage centre, circle stage left, stage right, overhead, etc. One EFX for each position.
If you want to have also 8, again one EFX for each position.
This is where relative comes handy: When relative is checked, EFX is added to whatever position the head is currently. You can create positions as Scenes with PAN/TILT channels, and create your EFX in a neutral position with offset x=127 and offset y=127. So you will have: set of position scenes (stage centre, circle stage left, stage right, overhead, etc.) and set of neutral EFX (circle, 8,...). In VC, create a set of buttons (solo frame) for positions, and another for EFX. You can even add XYPad and move the circle during the show wherever you want.
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Jano Svitok
David, George: I was thinking of displaying "guide lines" every 45 or 90 degrees, both for PAN and for TILT. Alternatively, we could scale the preview window according to PAN range:TILT range ratio, so that the EFX path would be to scale.
My ultimate goal is to enter and store EFX parameters in degrees so that we could exchange different moving heads without destroying the pattern. That requires some changes in QLC+ and some more information about fixtures.
My ultimate goal is to enter and store EFX parameters in degrees so that we could exchange different moving heads without destroying the pattern. That requires some changes in QLC+ and some more information about fixtures.
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david garyga
Sounds like a lot of work
I think the current EFX parameters are OK, as they clearly act on dmx channels, and not on angles. It is raw and simple. But parameters could be added in the first tab of the EFX editor, to change the range of PAN/TILT channels for each head attached to the EFX, so a 540⁰ PAN range fixture could adapt to a 360⁰ PAN range fixture.
Or... Can this be done with channel modifier ?
In the meantime, I've been fidling around with the 2d preview, and it is possible to create a preview that represents the 2d coordinates of where the head is pointing at.
Do you think it is a good idea to add a checkbox to change the "preview mode" in the efx editor ?
With the possibility of changing the range of PAN/TILT angles (this effects the preview only, not the EFX output)
If so, I will clean this up and create a pull request.
Cheers.
I think the current EFX parameters are OK, as they clearly act on dmx channels, and not on angles. It is raw and simple. But parameters could be added in the first tab of the EFX editor, to change the range of PAN/TILT channels for each head attached to the EFX, so a 540⁰ PAN range fixture could adapt to a 360⁰ PAN range fixture.
Or... Can this be done with channel modifier ?
In the meantime, I've been fidling around with the 2d preview, and it is possible to create a preview that represents the 2d coordinates of where the head is pointing at.
Do you think it is a good idea to add a checkbox to change the "preview mode" in the efx editor ?
With the possibility of changing the range of PAN/TILT angles (this effects the preview only, not the EFX output)
If so, I will clean this up and create a pull request.
Cheers.