Q Light Controller+

Thank you for responding to a request on another forum for a sACN/E1.31 Plugin....much, MUCH appreciated.

I noticed that there seems to be a limit of 4 universes with the QLC+ Artnet Plugin...both in the QLC+ docs & in my experience with 6-port Artnet Bridge (only 1st 4 universes are usable by QLC+).

I have not yet tried multiple ArtNet bridges on one Ethernet-->QLC+...waiting for additional 6-port ArtNet bridge to test.

Can QLC+ ArtNet plugin support more than 4 universes?

Hi, well technically there shouldn't be a problem to handle more universes...but what for ?
Are you really going to need 3072 DMX addresses ?

Is there ever a need for more than 4 DMX universes? Yes.

That was not my question. I'll be more clear. What are the cases where you need more than 4 universes ?
Please list a few and convince me of this need.
The only one I can think of is a massive use of RGB LED strips. Meaning you have more than 680 (170*4) LEDs (for each universe 170 * 3 = 510)

I think the issue here is why is there even a limit of 4 universes? I have been in situations where I have used way more than 4 universes. One example would be due to cable runs. It makes more sense to run a universe for the follow spots at the back of the theatre even if they are only going to be using 6 DMX channels each. Then there are the bigger events we have worked on using Art-Net with 16+ universes due to universes going to various different locations.

With QLC+ I don't see why there is even a limit in the software on adding universes, I see no technical reason why there should. The limit for Art-Net Version 3 is 32,768 universes. I see no reason why anyone should use that many but you know what, I am sure Art-Net 4 will go even further. At the end of the day if there is no reason not to support more universes then why not do it. Personally I would like to see QLC+ support at least 10 universes.

The other issue I have with QLC+ is the lack of LTP support, I again see no reason why this isn't an option for the user.

That's just my 2¢.

Agree. I regularly work at a club that uses 8 universes using ShowCAD Artist (and quickly running out of channels).

QLC exists since 13 years and QLC+ since one year, and guys, you are the first who raised this.
I could conclude that average QLC+ users don't need more than 4 universes.
As for cables, you know about the existance of DMX splitters, right ?

In fact my question (which no one answered yet) was: can you please tell me the cases where you use more than 2048 DMX channels ?

In a few words: if this is a "do it yourself" exercise I am not going to second it. If this is a real need, please give me valid reasons why that 95% of QLC+ users should care about being able to have 32768 universes.
To me supporting hundreds of universes to use 6 channels each sounds totally absurd. I would say there's something wrong in the project design.

Maybe I'm wrong cause I don't work in professional lighting productions. One thing I know though is how QLC+ works. At first I though we were talking about 8 universes, which shouldn't be much of a problem, but now I take you're asking for dynamic universes (up to 128, 1024, 32768) and QLC+ is not designed for that. It would require a major architecture change.

@John: LTP exists in QLC since many years. I don't understand why you stated that here, completely off topic. If you found a bug or something please open another thread.

I think for now expanding to 8 would be wise, especially as 13 years ago we didn't have RGB arrays like we do now.

I do work in the professional lighting industry and have the fortune to get to do something I love doing. QLC+ is a brilliant piece of software because of its flexibility. The hard coded limit of universe limits is something I can understand on why it would exist but I think sooner or later the demand is going to grow for larger number of universes.

We use QLC+ in a few interesting environments at the moment but can't push it as far as we want due to the limit on universes. We want to be able to do huge arrays of RGB pars and RGB strips, as you can imagine 4 universes really runs out quite quickly when you get to this point. For now our work around is to have multiple computers all running QLC+ with some midi tieing the sync together. This works for now but again, it is less than ideal.

Please consider adding 8 universes as a minimum and look to the future. You're right that 13 years ago we only really needed 1 universe (2 if you were doing something radical!) but now the fixtures are getting more and more channel hungry. I would argue that we'll see a huge change to Art-Net in the industry in the next few years as it is just better designed for today's requirements (considering DMX was really designed to remove the large bundles of cables coming from the control desks).

@Massimo, yes I have heard of a DMX Buffer, they are very usefull but sometimes you want a separate universe as I described earlier purely for the fact that it can then be sent through a different chain (IE through a hardware controller for the DLX [Deputy Lighting Director] to control separately.).

I hope my answer is helpful.

John, your answer IS helpful, especially cause you face the real world issues that come from lighting environments.

It is true indeed that RGB pixel matrices are very channels demanding, but it's true also that QLC+ is not quite ready for that. A piece of my heart tears apart saying this, but seeing what other controllers do makes me saying QLC+ is light years behind them.

In one year I have improved many aspects of this software, gathered brilliant ideas and real users needs, so now QLC+ can be sometimes the best cost-effective choice. It is evident though that RGB matrices still need a ton of love and a consequence of that much love will almost certainly be breaking the 4 universes limit.

I do really want QLC+ to be considered at the level of commercial softwares but as you can imagine, one single person can't have the same speed of paid development teams.

I think the technical solution will stay on 4 universes as a start. Then I will add a "+" button to add more universes. Sounds good ?

Thank you very much. The work that you have put in over the last year is certainly starting to pay off. I look forward to seeing the new features in upcoming builds!

Thank you once again, keep up the good work.

I just wanted to add a few comments after reading this thread. First and foremost, Massimo, I don't think you have ANYTHING to be ashamed of as far as QLC+ goes. Of course if you compare it to purpose built lighting consoles that cost tens of thousands of dollars, there are going to be things that are lacking, but when you compare QLC+ to many, many programs, your software is simply better. Perhaps it's not as pretty as some, but that's really not an issue with something like a DMX desk.

That said, even for a small install, I use two universes, primarily so that I can run one from a DMX interface and one over Art-Net. It's similar to what John is saying but not to the same extent. That said, I'm getting somewhat close to running out of channels on my existing DMX universe which would push me up to three universes. I'm not saying I need infinite universes but I can at least foresee a situation where I might need a few more.

In any case, keep up the great job!

Hi Massimo,

Just wanted to say that I do appreciate what you've done. Only one year after forking QLC, QLC+ is way closer to the goal of competing with commercial software than ever before. Keep it up!

Joe

ps - I assume John was referring to being able to set channels as LTP/HTP. He's got a point here. I often have to edit my fixtures to make the intensity channels into tilt channels so I can get LTP (But why is for a different topic).

Totally agree...QLC+ is already really useful & marching boldly forward. Thank you for your hard work and continued consideration of ideas to help it grow. Asking on a forum about an unclear limitation is never meant to complain..just understand. Then see if others are having a similar issue and how we all can overcome it.

The compromise to keep a default of 4 universes but include a "+" button in the Config_ArtNet_Plugin window to add more universes sounds excellent. To help you test it...can we just add universes until things choke? ..what clues suggest whether its the ArtNet plugin, Ethernet or QLC+ Architecture causing problems?

Some additional considerations come to mind:

Computers with multiple network interfaces would need some way to indicate to which IP address the Universe is being added.

Just thinking toward the future of many universes in QLC+...while modifying the ArtNet plugin, it might also be helpful to eventually allow user naming of Universes (ie: [192.168.100.04]Universe:07 can be assigned a "friendly_name" like Top_Truss or Floor_Fixtures). This seems useful even with node ShortName & LongName on the NodesTree tab when one ArtNet node has multiple universes (like the 6-universe device mentioned in my first post).

..possibly an issue for a separate discussion..friendly_naming of universes might benefit users of any combination of interfaces as things grow, so maybe a new column for "friendly name" in the I/O Mapping window could be more useful than in the ArtNet Config window? Is the architecture of QLC+ such that it could then display Universe friendly_name throughout (ie: Fixtures_Groups)?